We're not English, we are Scouse. Or are we?

By Dan Kay on Jun 24, 10 12:33 PM in Fans

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YOU would have to be on the remotest goat-herding plane in the Yemen not to notice that there is a World Cup on at the moment.

While for many Liverpudlians it may come as a pleasant diversion to the seemingly endless litany of woes that plague Anfield at present, it strikes an interesting debate as to where people's loyalties ultimately lie.

For the likes of Stan Collymore and his Talksport-ilk, it is the national team 'uber alles'

Others are happy enough to get in the spirit of things while the tournament is on before switching attention back to their club side when it all ends, as it predictably does, in tears.

For others, there is a very real, and deep-felt, antipathy towards the England football team.

A friend articulates it such:

"Right then you horrible, thieving Scouse so-and-sos, it's time to support YOUR country.

Yep, it is apparently, except the rest of this cesspit country can get stuffed.

I am sick of seeing these biffs walking round OUR city in tatty England T-shirts (the sort you get in the bargain bin for £2.99 at Sports Direct). The amount of flags (albeit cheaply put together) hanging out of windows is truly frightening. Is Liverpool losing its sense of identity? I'd argue it's beginning to.

If I'm spoiling the party for people, then sorry. Everyone's entitled to support England if they want to, but why would they anyway? I think people are less indifferent all of a sudden and seem to buy into all this false patriotism as though they are being told to.

I can't quite put my finger on it, but suffice to say, this Ing-er-lund mentality that's creeping in here is disturbing.

There were four coppers outside The Queens and The First National when I walked past at 5pm yesterday - no doubt expecting some sort of mini-riot like we got in Clayton Square during the last World Cup if they'd have been knocked out.

Politically, people just seem to be so out of touch these days that they have no idea. I mean, how can a team that holds up Rooney as its star man be representative of this city? He has loathed by both Reds and Blues and has alienated a WHOLE city - some achievment that! He is also a lover of The S*n and takes great delight in declaring his hatred for all things LFC. Ergo, as far as I am concerned, supporting this mob is akin to buying The S*n or supporting Man United.

The Cameron mask at the USA game - does that represent us too? Or the St George Flag that has printed on it the following: 'Born in England, Live in England, Die in England, MUFC'.
.
England represent Chelsea, Millwall and all the other tin-pot clubs that have nothing else to cheer about all year round. It's THEIR baby, so leave it to them, please.

I think someone recently made the analogy between the World Cup and New Year's Eve and they were spot on. NYE is awful and boozers are packed full of people who don't usually go out. The regulars can't get to the bar because it's heaving full of the other clowns and it is annoying beyond belief.

Similarly, all the hangers-on and 'non-football' fans latch on to the World Cup and use it as a vehicle to display some kind of contrived patriotism / nationalism. All this is capped off by the vile British media who take every opportunity to make snidy, jingoistic comments about the Germans, Argentinians and whoever else England might be playing. I won't even get started on the 'celebrity' vermin who nail their colours to the mast."

Personally I've felt whatever affiliation I initially felt towards the national team as a child ebb away at various points over the years - key factors in this being the sickening treatment John Barnes received in an England shirt ; the snide remarks and treatment our club and city has received from the rest of the country over the years while cosying up as soon as they released they needed our star players (eg Gerrard) ; the shameless bandwagon-jumping and general hysteria evidenced whenever they win a throw-in counterbalanced with the wailing and gnashing of teeth the milli-second things start to go awry ; more than anything for me, it is the make-up of the current crop of England stars, many of whom seem to me to be a who's-who of people who sum up everything that's wrong with the modern game - neutrals surely find harder to warm to the likes of Terry, Rooney and Ashley Cole than they did Shearer, Sheringham and David Platt.

Yet the flags, banners and sheer volume of people buying into 'our boys' would indicate that support for the national team in Liverpool is as strong as it's ever been.

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Does this mean Liverpool as a city has forgotten where it's come from or just that people like any excuse to sag off work (yes, some of us do have jobs) and drink beer while watching football?

Maybe it's just been too long since the last Tory government. I wonder how different things might be by the time Brazil 2014 comes around.

14 Comments

luke said:

I'm supporting England simply because Stevie is the captain, johnson is in the team and carra is back in the squad. Imagine all the bad press stevie would have got if england had gone out last night.

If there were no Liverpool players in the side, i would be rooting for every team they played against.

aidan said:

same here!i just want a liverpool player to win to world cup no matter what country it is!maybe then they can bring some of that winning mentality back to the club for the new season.as long as there are no injuries to our important players i don't give a toss about england.the world cup is just filling in the gap till the main event starts in august.YNWA

Tony said:

Not everyone walking around in an England shirt is a drunk hooligan cheering on England only because their local team is 'tin pot'.
When I see Rooney in an England shirt I don't see the whining little blue nosed Manc I just see an England player, and if he scores a hat trick every game and wins the world cup for us then so be it.

Some people are patriotic and some aren't, I guess you and a lot of other scousers aren't, believe me it's nothing to be proud of.

Craig said:

Well I'm Scouse and English. I support both.

mop ed said:

I think many of the current 'England fans' in the city rarely go the game. They never got their education at the ground. So they are unaware of the history. It's always the City before the country.
I have never supported England and never will.
I can't bring myself to.
I have no respect for the royal family. The national anthem makes me cringe.
The fans I can't relate to.
Why should I cheer alongside fans who for all the years I've been watching Liverpool (since the 70s) have come to Liverpool and insulted it. If we were of a 'colour' it would be deemed racist.
Then there is the booing of former players who played for England such as Neal, Barnes and McManaman.
Then there is the way the city was treated by the Tory government in the 80s and 90s.
They let the city die a slow death.
Finally the players.
Rooney is akin to an uncle Tom. He is a traitor to the city of his birth. He collects money while he plays for a team whose supporters insult his birthplace weekly.Why should I support that man?
John Terry needs no explanation.
ABE forever.

Lee said:

Idiotic, pointless debate if you ask me. This just goes to prove what spineless traitors we have in this country when our own people want other countries to win.

I'm proud to be English and proud to be a Liverpool fan....and based on what people are saying above, I'm also glad I wasn't born in Liverpool.

Liverpool fans are supposed to be the most intelligent, one can only assume they didn't interview anyone from the dump that is Merseyside.

Get your priorities right, idiots.

Noblelox said:

@ Lee, well if you're not from here, shove off and support the team from where you come from, you plastic, glory hunting embarrassment!

If you're too poorly educated to even understand the issues, don't go mouthing off as if you have a valid opinion in anyway. If you think the city is a dump, then, you share a very strong link with all other England fans, you are a spineless, two faced hypocrite.

Mikey said:

I agree am a scouse man NOT a english man, Y.N.W.A

Jason said:

I agree about the England players, to think it could have been a foul thug like Ferdinand who picked up the world cup, the first englishman since Bobby Moore. Says it all really.
My family is mixed english/irish so I've never been to bothered about England though I do watch the world cup but if offered the choice of England winning the world cup or LFC stuffing Arsenal in the first game I'd take LFC any day.

Also the media is just crass.

Tony said:

Makes me laugh when Liverpool supporters call anyone not from Merseyside plastic glory hunters, but you'd bite the hand of a rich arab if he wanted to buy the club.

shaun johnstone said:

scouse,scouse an then scouse i dont care about london united fc,i feel more passion watchin spain,argentina or an underdog nation than i do watchin "tha ingerland"i cudnt cheer fat frank or john terry or fat wayne or cashley

Matt said:

I am only English because some political bureaucrat down in london gives me a passport saying Great Britain. Yet, I am born and bread scouser and proud of it my choice. My family originates from Ireland way back and then Liverpool and goes no further south. Why should I relate to the rest of England considering the stick you get from being from Liverpool. Its like any sort of discrimination against people they rise up and fight their corner, and it still exists for all you people who think it doesn't, with stuck in the 80s idiotic empty headed comments.

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